From a reader: Traditional Parishes in Southeast Wisconsin

From a reader:

I hope this finds you well, I read your blog on the limited number or TLM parishes in WI when I was looking for a new parish. My wife and I are looking to move to Lake Geneva - Burlington area in the next few years.

My parents are looking to move sooner and we want them to end up close to us so our current and future children will have grandparents close by. Anyway to my question, do you have advice or resources on not just TLM parishes which seem kind of far away from the Lake Geneva area, but even reverent Novus Ordo parishes with a quality parish school?

I apologise for the very specific question from a stranger but your blog was one of the few sources I keep coming back to in my search for a parish.

No apology needed!  I've got to meet or correspond with many of you through the area and I really enjoy getting a chance to hear from you all.  I'll see if I can't ping a few people and get some more input, but let's see if we can get some readers to chime in to assist.  BTW, my goal is still to photograph every church in the state, but I'm going to need to figure out how to get an early retirement package to make it happen, haha.

Kenosha is about 45 minutes away and I'm pretty sure they still have the Latin Mass going there.   As far as non-dual form parishes, I'll have to get some more input.  Also you are likely out of range for any of the classical model schools.  I'll update this post if I get some email replies.

Update:
Mt. Carmel near 52nd st and 22 ave. Noon Sunday. Also Saturdays am.

---

Check St Peter's in Volvo Illinois about 1/2 south of Lake Geneva on US rt 12.

Reader feedback request: Seeking good parish near the Wausau/WisconsinRapids/StevensPoint area of the state

Dear Badger Catholic, Duke of La Crosse,

I've recently purchased a home near Mosinee, WI which is sort of in that beer flavored gooey center of the state near the Wausau/WisconsinRapids/StevensPoint area.  My point in emailing you is to survey your knowledge and your readers. What is the best close parish?

Here is what I know. ICKSP is in Wausau, less than 30 minutes away. SP is a heterodox jungle. WI Rapids is also less than 30 minutes away, and I've heard a good parish exists there but they are getting a new pastor. Their is a decent priest in Polonia, which isn't very far; I forget the name.

Finding a good parish is a painful thing for a young family, many thanks for any assistance.

I'd love to get some comments for this one as I have fewer spies in the great heart of Wisconsin.  Sts. Peter and Paul is as good a parish as you will find, the new pastor is fantastic, but yeah it will be sort of a round about drive.  Also, like you said the ICKSP is in Wausau so that's a great option and it's going to be pretty close.  I'm not aware of any decent diocesan parishes in Wausau itself.  Your really not too far from Marshfield either, St. John the Baptist is pretty good there, the interior is top notch ... would be a perfect spot for a little ad orientem... cough.

Readers feedback appreciated!

Reader seeking Catholic parish in Rochester MN

Dear Matt,

I recently came across your blog. I have friend living in Rochester who is reverting to the faith, but I know will be repulsed by modern liberal liturgies.

Can you tell me what is the best orthodox parish to go to in your area?

thanks

My reply but looking for more feedback, firing off the hip here so feel free to correct: 

St Francis of Assisi - Rochester, MN

---

There is a Rochester Latin Mass Society, they have a semi regular Latin Mass just south of Rochester. http://www.rochesterlatinmasssociety.org  The new priest though is not so interested so they are only getting like every other Sunday Masses right now, I think(correct me if I'm wrong). I hear probably the best place to go for non Latin Mass is St. Francis (http://stfrancis-church.org/) if it's necessary but I think some things are less than ideal, the choir is all up in the sanctuary and stuff. The priest there is pretty good I think, but the culture of the clergy in the diocese is such that nobody want's to make liturgical improvements for fear of retaliation by liberal priests/curia. The choir is "praise and worship" style, but the execution was one of the... best I've heard for that style, I remember the piano was not being banged on either, but actually complimented the choir well.  A violinist as well if I remember - under the right direction this choir would be a gem.  If their Facebook page is any indicator, they are on the right path.

Other than that there's really no good parishes in Rochester, I have a friend who works in Rochester and drives 45 minutes or so to Wabasha, MN who has a great priest stationed there. My experience is the whole area is really a void for the most part(unless you like 100% English, praise and worship 4 hymn sandwich).  La Crosse is about an hour away with some decent options. Or in the other direction .... I think there's a good parish in Owatonna(or maybe it was Mankato) , I'd have to double check, but it's about an hour in the other direction there's a good parish that way as well.  I think Sleepy Eye is going to be too far for regular Mass.  

---

It's been a while since I trekked around the Winona Diocese on a regular basis.  Feedback appreciated.  Notice I didn't add that group that will only use liturgical texts prior to like the 1900s?  LOL!

... when I say "good parish" I mean good liturgy from my perspective.  

Ah, forgot to mention St. James Coffee Shop!

Help for a reader looking for a parish in Appleton

Hello,

I happened upon your website and wonder if you have a recommendation for an orthodox Catholic Church in Appleton, WI?  We would love a TLM.  We certainly definitely want solidly orthodox, true to Church teachings and not innovative, etc.

Thank you for any help,

Actually, I've only driven through I think, on the way to the Big Shrine(Good Help) and the little shrine(Lambeau).  I was going to go one year when my cousin was in the state baseball championship but the stars did not align.  I know there are readers from Appleton, care to give your input on the Catholic scene?

Parish shopping clearance sale

I was interested to read Fr Z's post on parish membership.  It's something we struggle with as a family.  Last Sunday by circumstance we attended 10 am Mass at our territorial parish in La Crosse.  They were also hosting a softball tournament over the weekend (I found it odd game times on Sunday needlessly started at 9 a.m. and seemed to discourage Mass attendance).  Part way through the homily the priest stepped aside* and let lay theologian from Viterbo, Tom Thibodeau, give the rest of the homily(which was passionate and terrifying).  We almost walked out.  Don't worry, it is on Youtube for anyone to watch, and displayed on the parish website.  He did this at all weekend Masses, not just one.   Believe it or not, I was the one that wanted to stay(well I had to play at 11 am right after Mass, just call me Judas).  Plus, through the years I've seen some pretty bad stuff, and this wasn't the worst.  At any rate, the talk was something about the new parish mission statement which was prominently on display next to the altar in a frame.  And for the record, there are alot of young, small, Catholic families that attend there as well.   The point is, I would move if I was required to register at that parish.  I know good people who attend there.  I have found in the past the priest to be actually quite solid, all organ music now.  But I vote with my feet. Always have.  And unfortunately always will.  I am quite impressed that Mr. Berres sticks it out at his home parish, despite, well, bad stuff from his priest.  It requires a virtue I have not obtained.

Point being, we recently joined a new parish in La Crosse.  One of the reasons we haven't really found a home is that we are Traditionalists(of the obedient type).  We would like our children to receive First Communion at a Traditional Latin Mass.  In fact, we also hold the extreme view that we'd like our children to be baptized in the Traditional rite.  Our bishop does perform the Traditional rite of Confirmation so he seems to be accepting of the practice.  That doesn't mean we think there's something wrong with the Ordinary Form either.  I'm not one of these angry, fist-shaking traddy's that's in the back of church with a notebook scribbling frantically when a priest stutters during a prayer.  I'm one who discovered a pearl and cherishes it.  I don't know Latin, but I like to learn to sing the ordinary chants from the pew(it's not as hard as you think).  From attending the TLM for a few years now, I can sing most of the Credo(III) from memory.  I'm no expert, all I know is that experience of the ancient liturgy is one of which I want and need more.

I asked a priest with our last child's baptism if he would consider using the Traditional Rite.  He was annoyed and told me he would do the entire rite in Latin but only in the Ordinary Form(and then left the room before I could reply).  Here's the thing, I don't prefer the old way because it's in Latin.  If I had a choice of attending the Extraordinary Form almost entirely in English or the Ordinary Form entirely in Latin, I would go to the Extraordinary Form Mass.  So now I know that is not a normal question to ask a diocesan priest unless I know him really well.  He may have simply been unfamiliar with it, and not necessarily opposed to it but I never got an explanation.  Our forthcoming baby baptism will also be in the Ordinary Form at our new parish.  Not all of us have a St. Agnes parish or a Madison Cathedral parish which are happy to accommodate for either Extraordinary or Ordinary forms.  It would seem if I hold these "extremist" views, I should seek out a religious order who "specializes" in them.  It has been easy for me to see why people "fled" to the SSPX through the years with a helpful push(and no I wouldn't join even if they reconcile).

Yes, I know, Summorum Pontificum.  There are no diocesan priests assigned to this area who have the training.  Hence, I appreciate Fr. Z's call for priests to learn the Extraordinary Form - even if no one has yet requested it.  Some priests are open to learning it but need to find the time; I think the FSSP has a week long boot camp or something like that of which at least one priest from this diocese has availed himself to.  At any rate, there is no ideal diocesan parish in the La Crosse area for the Traditionalist.  This usually is a shock to young families that have moved to the area expecting the diocese to be a bastion of traditionalism from the influence of the Cardinal.  I have at times played with the idea of moving somewhere in the area where that type of parish would be closer.  But for the time being, I will sit and wait, and vote with my feet when the time arises. 

*Just in case I have someone think this is an acceptable practice; from the GIRM:

66. The Homily should ordinarily be given by the Priest Celebrant himself or be entrusted by him to a concelebrating Priest, or from time to time and, if appropriate, to the Deacon, but never to a lay person.*  In particular cases and for a just cause, the Homily may even be given by a Bishop or a Priest who is present at the celebration but cannot concelebrate.

Shop til ya drop - parish shopping

My wife and I have been parishioners at the Cathedral in La Crosse since before we were married.  They have a fantastic music program, and overall a solid liturgy, but we are looking for a new parish.  Don't get me wrong, there are some great people at Cathedral, it was a family there we became friends with that first got us interested in homeschooling.  There just aren't going to be any big traditional leaps happening and we felt called to move to a smaller parish.  So we began the process we've all come to enjoy; parish shopping.

I think The American Catholic says it well:

Some of the things [the shopper] looks for are an orthodox priest faithful to the Magisterium, a beautiful Church, and a liturgy that aspires to beauty and lacks some of the folksy elements of post-Vatican II as well as the more scandalous aspects of the “spirit of Vatican II” like liturgical dancers.

That sums it up pretty well but I thought I would expand on it a bit for my own sake. 

1.  Music

No drum set.  Check.  No guitars.  Check.  No pianos.  Check.  We're already half way there.  Choir in choir loft or rear of church?  Check.  Now that it is possible to actually survive a Sunday liturgy, let's talk about the specifics.  I cannot recommend enough how important the book Why Catholics Can't Sing makes the whole concept of congregational singing apparent even to uneducated folk like me.  The goal as a parish should be to sing the proper chants of the Mass in Latin.  If there's no plan in place that chant be "given pride of place" in the liturgy, I'm not interested.  There is certainly a place for well selected hymns in this mix, but when hymns replace the words of the liturgy itself, things are headed in the wrong direction.

2. Black & Red

Do you say the black and to the red?  If you are interjecting your personality or politics into the Mass, I'm pushing eject.  Here's a true story.  After the big priest shift in the Diocese of La Crosse, we started attending different Masses in the area.  The most beautiful parish church in La Crosse is Holy Trinity.  We went to one Mass and it didn't take long to find out what the new priest was like.  During Mass he changed the words of the Creed from "born of the Virgin Mary and became man" to "born of the Virgin Mary and became human."  Almost walked out.  It's like being scammed by a bait and switch.  One quick way to lose any interest in joining your parish.

3. Beauty

Is your church a circle?  If it is, why haven't you fixed it yet?  If I want to waste my time walking in spiritual circles instead of pushing onward to the heavenly beatitude, I'll start smoking hash and rubbing Budda's belly.  We all know how hard it can be to find a church that has not been destroyed by a "worship committee."  Basically you have the beautiful, wreckovated, and repaired wreckovation.  A rule of thumb is to steer away from anything built within the last 40 years(there are exceptions of course).  We are looking for something sacred, something our ancestors would be proud of.

4. Extraordinary

Ideally for any parish, especially in a city, should have both the ordinary and the extraordinary form of the Roman Rite.  St. Agnes in St. Paul comes to mind.  Whether once a month or just on special occasions, or just knowing that the parish is open to the idea if enough people are interested is extremely important.  As Pope Benedict stated so well, the ordinary and the extraordinary forms should provide "mutual enrichment."  There are many options here to help make it accessible to the newbie, if the parish is willing.  Completely opposed?  Funny, my sentiments exactly on joining your parish. 

5. Parish life

Several other factors come into play.  Is there a school, and is it any good?  If not, is there a homeschooling group?  Location matters too, but you will find that we are willing to travel great distances for what we are looking for.  Are there babies crying during Mass?  If not, that's a very bad sign.  Does the parish have a focus on projects, like the missions, etc., so that parishioners are enabled to perform corporal works of mercy(something other than scheduled diocesan second collections)?  Community is important, but unlike in a liberal parish where it is the end unto itself, it should exist to support the growth in holiness, proper worship of God, and promotion of traditional Catholic devotions.

Alright, that got long.  In Part II of this series I'll look at some specific examples.